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Conservative's ForumConservative's Discussion ForumsConstitutional Issues › Did Justice Roberts simply miss this authority?
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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Did Justice Roberts simply miss this authority? (Read 7,231 times)
Shooterman
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Re: Did Justice Roberts simply miss this authority?
Reply #20 - 08/09/12 at 09:39:30
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Picker wrote on 08/06/12 at 10:25:08:
Story does not quarrel with the Court's authority to rule on the constitutionality of a piece of legislation.  Unless one can find, in the Constitution, a described mechanism for the Court to enforce its ruling, Story is correct in his opinion that only the Congress can correct a mistake that the Congress has made.


I believe I would differ with you and Mr Story, Pick. Any law passed by Congress must, of necessity be constitutional or it is invalid. Congress may, with consent of the SCOTUS by either affirmation or usurpation make bad law, but that in itself does not make it constitutional.

Ultimately, based upon the Kentucky and Virginia Resolutions of 1798 and 1799, bad law was to be offset by nullification by the states, who as the final arbiters of what the created ( general government ) could do or not do to the creators. ( the states ) Of course, any nullification by the states must has the ultimate stick available to be efficacious.

Again, I must suggest the reading of The Law of The Land bt R Carter Pittman at http://rcarterpittman.org/essays/judiciary/Law_of_the_Land.html

An excerpt which I believe is at the heart of the matter.

"If there is one thing clear from the history of our people and from the plain words of the Constitution, it is the proposition that a decision of the Supreme Court of the United States is not "the law of the land." The word "law" is never used in the Constitution in a connotation that might justify the belief that anyone dreamed then that a judge might make law. The word "law" means law enacted by the representatives of the people or set forth in the Constitution itself or in treaties. '

I believe the Court must determine the validity and/or constitutionality of any law passed by Congress. Clearly Roberts and the liberal Justices failed in their duty to do so.

Quote:
In the case of the health care mandate, that would still be true regardless of which way the court came down.


If Congress now determines that each person or family can be taxed if they do not drive a GM car, must we wait for Congress to rescind that law?
  

Our Bill of Rights constitutes a cluster of little foxholes of liberty ground into the hard cold face of history by helpless men for a shield against the lash of tyrants. They are the result of distrust of power and distrust of men in power. They are a recognition of Lord Acton's statement of a truth eternal--"power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts absolutely."R. CARTER PITTMAN&&Dalton, Ga., Sept. 28, 1955.DRAFT JAN MORGAN FOR PRESIDENT!
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Picker
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Re: Did Justice Roberts simply miss this authority?
Reply #21 - 08/10/12 at 15:07:02
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In the absence of enforcement power, the Supreme Court is essentially an advisory institution.  If the Court finds a law to be unconstitutional, the responsibility for changing it falls back on the Congress.  The Congress may or may not respond favorably, and if the electorate finds this to be unacceptable they can make the necessary changes at the polls.
  
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Trip
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Re: Did Justice Roberts simply miss this authority?
Reply #22 - 08/11/12 at 03:06:51
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Picker wrote on 08/10/12 at 15:07:02:
In the absence of enforcement power, the Supreme Court is essentially an advisory institution.  If the Court finds a law to be unconstitutional, the responsibility for changing it falls back on the Congress.  The Congress may or may not respond favorably, and if the electorate finds this to be unacceptable they can make the necessary changes at the polls.



Fortunately our rights are not subject to a vote, and the founders did not leave our only recourse being a vain appeal to a corrupt judiciary.
  

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Picker
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Re: Did Justice Roberts simply miss this authority?
Reply #23 - 08/14/12 at 07:36:54
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Trip wrote on 08/11/12 at 03:06:51:
Fortunately our rights are not subject to a vote, and the founders did not leave our only recourse being a vain appeal to a corrupt judiciary.


Your reply is not responsive.  I did not claim nor suggest that our rights could be threatened by a vote.  Also, I stated clearly that, if the Court finds  law to be unconstitutional, it is up to the Congress to take corrective action.  No mention was made of any appeal to "a corrupt judiciary", since no such appeal is available.
  
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Trip
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Re: Did Justice Roberts simply miss this authority?
Reply #24 - 08/14/12 at 22:10:56
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Picker wrote on 08/14/12 at 07:36:54:
Your reply is not responsive.  I did not claim nor suggest that our rights could be threatened by a vote.  Also, I stated clearly that, if the Court finds  law to be unconstitutional, it is up to the Congress to take corrective action.  No mention was made of any appeal to "a corrupt judiciary", since no such appeal is available.


My response was quite responsive, just not within the scope of your own paradigms.


What you clearly indicated was that our rights are subject to majority opinion, quote:

     "The Congress may or may not respond favorably, and if the electorate finds this to be unacceptable they can make the necessary changes at the polls."



"A vote" can no more legitimize a President as a natural born citizen, when he is unqualified,  than it can make something constitutional when it clearly is not. We are not a Democracy aspiring to be a Republic only when convenient for the majority,  but rather we are a Republic that is collapsing into a dictatorial democracy and oligarchy because too few understand the Constitution.

If a law is unconstituitonal, it is null and void at face value. And maintenance of the constitutionality of laws and Congress, does not require polling of the majority of people, but rather  a tireless,  determined minority to speak up.

O-Care has not been constitutional for one moment since its passage.







  

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Re: Did Justice Roberts simply miss this authority?
Reply #25 - 08/14/12 at 23:12:41
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Trip wrote on 08/14/12 at 22:10:56:
My response was quite responsive, just not within the scope of your own paradigms.


What you clearly indicated was that our rights are subject to majority opinion, quote:

     "The Congress may or may not respond favorably, and if the electorate finds this to be unacceptable they can make the necessary changes at the polls."



"A vote" can no more legitimize a President as a natural born citizen, when he is unqualified,  than it can make something constitutional when it clearly is not. We are not a Democracy aspiring to be a Republic only when convenient for the majority,  but rather we are a Republic that is collapsing into a dictatorial democracy and oligarchy because too few understand the Constitution.







More plainly, then:  If the Congress passes a law which the president then signs, and subsequently the Supreme court finds that law to be unconstitutional, that is the limit of the Court's ability to act on that law.  The Congress may or may not accept the Court's finding, since there is no authority requiring it to act.  If they do not choose to act, and the electorate is not happy with that decision, the voters can change the makeup of the Congress at the next election. 

You seemed to conclude that I claimed that the voters can alter our rights.  Not so.  I will take the responsibility for not making myself clear, but not for your failure to understand what I say.
  
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Re: Did Justice Roberts simply miss this authority?
Reply #26 - 08/15/12 at 05:08:05
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  Trip, yOur comments about the Senate being a terrible set up, where a few aristocrats are  given too much power for too long is excellent critical thinking. We should have a diferent set up of government. No politician should serve more than two years.
   The necessary and proper clause is not on open ended clause to give government the power to make National Health care or Natl educatrion laws. It gives the government the power to pass laws and expenditures that pertain to enumerated powers. The government has the right to buy pen paper and Computers to carry out their functions. The military can buy meta, machine guns,l and Gasoline to carry out their power of making a military.
Take care!!
JAck
  
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Re: Did Justice Roberts simply miss this authority?
Reply #27 - 09/07/12 at 13:43:25
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During the Democrat convention, last night, one of the speakers,(I forget which one) ridiculed the Republicans by asserting that they,"think they can sneak any tax they wish past the Congress by calling it a fee".  The irony of this charge is that Roberts based his decision on the same reasoning.  He said that a fee is a tax, and therefore is within the authority and the responsibility of the Congress to execute.
  
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